Ethics in Podcasting
by Anna Gunn
July 2021
Picking up the microphone holds transformative powers. It can take you from someone who has something to say, to someone who is saying it to a potentially worldwide audience. This is freedom of speech, it is your right. You’re exercising control over your own voice. But here’s the catch: if you’re interviewing other people in your podcast, you also hold control over their voices.
As the great saying goes, “with great power comes great responsibility!” Ok, yes, Spiderman might have also said that.
But just as you have the right to pick up the microphone, you now also have a responsibility - which is to ensure that anyone you share your platform with, i.e. your guests, are treated ethically and with respect. You are now a journalist, and independently of your feelings toward that word in the 21st century, it is up to you to ensure that you don’t lump yourself in the lower end of the reputation scale. The way to do that? Put in place some ethical guidelines for yourself, which will serve you and your audience in the long term.
A bit of personal experience here: many times I have experienced that utter tummy-turning sinking feeling you get when, after an interview you feel went great, actually publishes and you realize you sound like a bumbling idiot. The inevitable stuttering, stumbling, and tripping over your own words that occurs when you’re trying to candidly articulate your feelings on a complex subject, right there for everybody to hear. All because the podcaster did not pay me the courtesy of editing out those slips, or even give me the opportunity to listen to it prior to publishing. “Hang on”, you might be thinking, “it’s not up to me to do that”. Well, allow me to explain to you, dear podcasters, why it should be:
As an interviewee, I will NEVER share those podcasts, or promote them on my social media - which, you guessed it, isn’t great for the podcast’s visibility (and potential to reach sponsors - do I have your attention now?). Secondly, and far more important than my own ego (yes, I hate to admit that I am but human), those podcasts might have ended up publicly harming the cause I went there to highlight. Who wants to support a cause that has a bumbling fool for a spokesperson?!
Being on the receiving end of this lack of professional courtesy puts me - and your hypothetical guests - in a terrible place. The podcasts have been published, and as you know, nothing ever truly falls off the internet: once there, it’s there forever (more on that later). A large part of the podcast’s audience - i.e. the subscribers - will already have heard it. And if I ask for it to be taken down, I’m opening the door to a potential argument I’d rather not have, with a person who still has a platform I don’t, and you have heard of the Streisand effect, right? Right. So it’s then up to me to deal with - at best - the feeling of betrayal of not having been looked after, and - at worst - the understanding that I might have lost potential future income because “she sounds like a bumbling idiot, have you heard that one podcast?!”.
This puts you, the podcaster with guests, in a position of power. And if you want to use your voice to raise the voices of others, then it’s up to you to do it with the utmost respect for their story. It is up to you to guarantee that the trust your guests put in you is warranted.
I am sure you all know this, and that no one ever sets out to be disrespectful (except for that one guy… please don’t be that guy), and it just kind of happens… well, no. It can be prevented with a few, easy to implement, practical steps.
To begin with, you - the host - need to understand your own boundaries. You will never be able to respect your guest’s boundaries if you don’t set some for your own protection, and of those entering your show. Most companies do this as their “terms & conditions”, so why not set up your own at the start of your podcast?
Start by stating how long you wish your episodes to be, then work back from that to know how much time you’ll need from your guests. If you want your episodes to be 1 hour long, and you know you’ll have to edit stumbles, etc, ask your guest for an hour and a half - but be honest with that request, and don’t go over it.
If your guest is talking about other people (especially in a derogatory way, and this also includes their own family) they are essentially telling someone else’s story - which is not theirs to tell. Keep your guests on track by pulling them back into their own story, and edit out any non-essential sidestepping. You don’t have to be disrespectful about it, or interrupt the flow - just nudge them back, and edit out any non-essential parts later. Unless it’s absolutely relevant to the story, it stays on the cutting room floor.
“Ism’s”: sexism, racism, every other “ism”. Our culture and language are still steeped in them - which means you WILL trip up at some point. Either you or your guests are going to say something that is not okay. Please do not be tempted to hit publish without editing just because you feel your guests should have edited themselves while talking. It is your platform, and the buck stops with you - it is your responsibility to make it the best it can be. Educate yourself - keep on top of current social affairs, read, and make sure you don’t fall into the same traps that countless others have before you. And more importantly, ASK. Find a diverse group of friends you trust to be your -ism checkers, and if you’re unsure about something, ask them.
BUT, and this is extremely important: it’s not their job to educate you on your own biases - that’s your job, so make sure you do it before asking them. Also, make sure you have their permission to check in with them about the things you feel unsure about. If they refuse, do not guilt trip them into saying yes. It’s not their duty to do so.
Let me repeat the above paragraph for those at the back - i.e. all of us. Especially those of us who are white, liberal, progressive, etc, who think we are not racist. We don’t want to be, but we are - again, our western culture and language are steeped in racism - so the quicker you accept this, the quicker you can deal with it and get right to the point of acknowledging the fact that you will inevitably screw up, which leads us to…
The apology. WHEN you make a mistake, slip up, or do or say something unethical: own it, and truly apologise. Non-apologies such as “I’m sorry if YOU were offended by…” are not acceptable. Saying “sorry” is one of the hardest things to do (unless, like me, you’re British and you say sorry for holding a door open…). It’s also one of the most powerful. We are all humans, and you will make mistakes. Own them. If a public apology is warranted, do it. Honour the people you have dishonored and move on.
Fact check your podcast. Do not allow people to lie, tell “untruths” or “falsehoods”, but I repeat myself. Create a section at the start of the show to highlight the topics you’re going to discuss, and be sure to make notes of anything you need to look up after your interviews. Make sure that it is understood by all parties that if you find things that are not factually accurate you will not publish them. Again, you don’t need to be confrontational about the process - you can simply remove or edit out these parts.
When you remove things in the edit (when, not if), have a conversation with the interviewee to explain your reasoning, and make sure they’re still comfortable with the way you have told their story. This does not need to take up a huge amount of time. Simply send them the “final” edit (no need for title tracks or ad breaks), allow them to listen to it and approve it, and if there are any edits that need clearing up, do so.
As you’re editing, once you know the story you are going to tell, consider your audience, their age, and where they live. Are there any parts of the conversation that will need further context with a narrative voice? I’m not trying to make you feel old here, but consider that most western 20yo or younger never knew what it was like to grow up without a mobile phone, or what a phone directory was, or that some words that are now considered derogatory (and rightly so) were commonplace. Remember the language thing?... yeah.
Once everything is done, if at any point in time an interviewee retracts their permission to publish - honour their decision and delete the episode immediately. Please do not try to confront the person or talk them out of it. Honour their wishes, take it down, delete it from your hard drives, and make sure you tell them you have done so. And before you point out that I said in the beginning of the article that what’s on the internet is there forever: it is. But it doesn’t need to stick out like a sore thumb on your platform.
Saying all of the above - do you know what the best feeling in the world is? It’s when you feel heard and validated; when you listen back to podcasts ran by people who interviewed me in a way that has respected the story I needed to tell, who have edited it to make me sound far more clever than I really am - and have ultimately made me feel proud of having been interviewed on their show. Those are the podcasts that I will support time and time again, and will recommend to everyone who will listen.
Be that type of podcaster.
Anna Gunn has a background in theatre, film, and sound. She strongly believes in the power of the female story, the right to be heard, and in making sure everybody is listened to in the best way possible. Anna also has a very inspirational cat - the Bob, who would also like to have his own podcast. @mcgunnmedia